Timeline for Could someone in the Old Testament be saved without believing in Christ?
Current License: CC BY-SA 4.0
22 events
| when toggle format | what | by | license | comment | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Jun 28 at 22:09 | comment | added | Mr. Bond | Fine, your free to do want you want. But remember, for me this is not about "doctrines." It's about where your going to spend eternity, in short, I care! | |
| Jun 27 at 23:11 | comment | added | Ryan Pierce Williams | @Mr.Bond I have provided numerous NT scriptures - from Paul, from James, from Jesus in the Gospels - that explicitly state that eternal life is the reward for good deeds. You are simply turning a blind eye to the scriptures that clearly contradict you. I'm afraid further discussion here is pointless - you've made it clear that what you care about is your doctrines and not the truth of scripture. | |
| Jun 27 at 22:02 | answer | added | Dan Fefferman | timeline score: -2 | |
| Jun 27 at 20:05 | comment | added | Mr. Bond | Cont. and at Acts 10:45 Cornelius received the gift of the Holy Spirit and was saved in that instant. AFTER he received the Holy Spirt Peter had him water baptized. This also means that baptism is not a requirement for salvation. He did not do any good works to get saved, because one who is saved will do good works, see 2 Corinthians 5:17. My last two comments. "Ultimately" is defined as "finally, in the end. conclusion." Secondly, since you deny the deity of Jesus Christ your good works will not save you, only faith in Jesus Christ. Isaiah 64;6, Your works are like filthy rags. | |
| Jun 27 at 19:49 | comment | added | Mr. Bond | This statement of yours is a contradiction of what the Bible teaches. "Ultimately we are not judged on our doctrines, but upon how we live our lives." And you just said, " that eternal life, the promise, is a reward for good deeds." Eternal life is based on Jesus dying on that cross and putting your faith in Him. upon doing that you will do good deeds. This is what Paul and James taught. The thief on the cross did not do good deeds and Jesus told him he would be in Paradise that day with Jesus. At Acts 10:43-44, Peter was giving the house of Cornelius (a Roman soldier) the gospel. Cont. | |
| Jun 27 at 14:40 | comment | added | Ryan Pierce Williams | @Mr.Bond I never asserted there was a contradiction - but rather I pointed out to you that Paul says the same: that eternal life, the promise, is a reward for good deeds. You are ignoring a great wealth of scripture, including Christ's direct teachings. | |
| Jun 27 at 14:07 | answer | added | GratefulDisciple | timeline score: -1 | |
| Jun 27 at 13:53 | comment | added | Mr. Bond | @RyanPierceWilliams There is no contradiction between Paul and James. For example, when Abraham was 100 and Sara 90 years old, Abraham believed God would fulfill His promise. At James 2:21 taught that Abraham's obedience in offering Isaac at Genesis 22. (As a side note Abraham offered Isaac to the angel of the Lord, read Genesis 22.) The context makes it clear that James taught a person is justified by the kind of faith which is genuine and RESULTS in obedience. This is how Paul and James are reconciled. This is Biblical doctrine/teaching that result on how we live our lives. Pay attention! | |
| Jun 27 at 8:21 | comment | added | Ryan Pierce Williams | @Mr.Bond If you want to know who Christ knows and acknowledges before God, then see the parable of the sheep and goats. They are not distinguished by their doctrines, but by their good deeds towards the least of these. | |
| Jun 27 at 8:14 | comment | added | Ryan Pierce Williams | Those are my words - but you demonstrate that you don't understand them. Belief without works are dead and cannot save you - as taught in James 2. You are ignoring all of scripture for a couple lines from Paul that you demonstrate you don't understand. Paul himself taught that eternal life is the reward for good deeds in Romans 2. He advocates perseverance, lest you fall short and lose the prize (eternal life). Worst of all is that you ignore Christ's own words on the matter: you must lose your life to save it. It is foolish to think that holding the right doctrines is how Jesus knows you. | |
| Jun 26 at 23:41 | comment | added | Mr. Bond | These are your words. "Ultimately we are not judged on our doctrines, but upon how we live our lives." And btw, yes we are judged on our doctrines/what we believe. Paul explained this at Galatians 1:6-9 and at other places. Matthew 7:15-23 where Jesus is speaking. The four most lethal words in the Bible is at Matthew 7:23 where Jesus says, "I never knew you " Read Matthew 7. From reading your post you really struck me as being "naive." You better believe Jesus means business. I am not using scare tactics, just telling you the truth. Please read John 3:16. | |
| Jun 26 at 23:11 | comment | added | Ryan Pierce Williams | @Mr.Bond I most certainly did not say that Christ's death was somehow irrelevant to salvation. You are the one making the false deduction that if works are involved then that somehow invalidates the grace we recieve through Christ. Scripture teaches both grace and works, together. The parable of the Unforgiving Servant (Matthew 18:21-35) illustrates this point nicely. The servant is forgiven a large debt. However, this forgiveness is revoked when he himself does not forgive a much smaller debt. However, if he had forgiven that small debt - would that have earned him his forgiveness? No. | |
| Jun 26 at 22:58 | comment | added | Mr. Bond | So you deem Christ dying on that cross for nothing? He's sacrifice was to atone for humanity's sins and restore the relationship between God and humanity. This is described at 2 Corinthians 5:21. By trying to live a good life and doing good things won't cut it. How are you going to live up to Romans 3:23 since we all without exception fall short of the glory of God? | |
| Jun 26 at 22:37 | comment | added | Ryan Pierce Williams | @Mr.Bond The scriptures are quite explicit that eternal life is the reward for pursuing a good, righteous life (example: Romans 2:6-11). Jesus taught that you must give your life to save it (Matthew 16:25). It is not sufficient to cry “Lord, Lord” to be saved - for Jesus will reject you before his father and say that he does not know you. On the other hand, he will raise up and reward those who help the least of these. So then, we observe this truth: that through our loving actions we make God known to others, and through those we bless we in turn become known to God. | |
| Jun 26 at 22:17 | comment | added | Mr. Bond | @RyanPierceWilliams If we are judged by how we live our lives there would be no need for Jesus Christ to die on the cross for our salvation. Who taught you this? Are you a Unitarian? People in the Old Testament were saved the same way as those in the New Testament, through faith alone, by grace alone, and in Christ alone. Paul explains this at Romans 4. Abraham believed God and it was reckoned to him as righteousness. Please read the whole chapter and also read Hebrews 11:1. | |
| Jun 26 at 21:39 | answer | added | Andrew Shanks | timeline score: 3 | |
| Jun 26 at 17:58 | answer | added | So Few Against So Many | timeline score: -1 | |
| Jun 26 at 17:39 | comment | added | Michael16 | This is a common question, and it's quite politically incorrect or controversial that such topics gets closed. Was eternal life promised by the Mosaic Law? | |
| Jun 26 at 12:20 | comment | added | Ryan Pierce Williams | Belief in and of itself does not save anyone (James 2:14). The significance of belief is that it guides our actions - and by acting accordingly we can be saved. Ultimately we are not judged on our doctrines, but upon how we live our lives. | |
| Jun 26 at 3:48 | comment | added | Stephen Disraeli | In other words, what was the actual content of the faith of the "men of faith" listed in Hebrews ch11? | |
| Jun 26 at 3:48 | comment | added | curiousdannii♦ | At all times people must trust in the person of God and in the message he has revealed. In ancient times he had revealed less details of his great plan for salvation, but whatever he had revealed is what he expected people to trust. | |
| Jun 26 at 2:23 | history | asked | lightwalker | CC BY-SA 4.0 |