Timeline for Why has God punished every human for one person's sin?
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
18 events
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| Jun 20, 2018 at 16:31 | review | Suggested edits | |||
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| Jan 13, 2012 at 15:34 | comment | added | Probe Deeper | @ wax eagle, you mentioned Adam and Eve represent humanity similar to how representation works in government. This seems to be a flawed analogy since the people consciously choose their representatives in government exercising their free will. | |
| Jan 12, 2012 at 15:30 | comment | added | Jonathan. | ... it is up to that person to obey God or not. Through the Bible you find people disobeying God, going against God's will and yet that did not through off his plan. He's more powerful than humans, so just as the US President can decide to launch a nuclear attack on a country and the average Joe Bloggs can't, we aren't capable of making decisions that would be able to throw off God's plan, never mind that his plan will work no matter what we do. | |
| Jan 12, 2012 at 15:27 | comment | added | Jonathan. | @waxeagle, so what happened to free will then? The reason there is sin is because of human free will, God is perfect and therefore couldn't have created something sinful, so becoming sinful must have been a human decision. (IMO) His plan is not just for one circumstance, his plan works in all circumstances. Given that Adam and Eve had free will (which they must have as they sinned), they could've chosen to obey God, and then there wouldn't have been a need for God's plan for Jesus. God will tell people what he wants them to do, e.g. to go to non-Christian countries and spread his word, but.... | |
| Jan 12, 2012 at 15:21 | comment | added | wax eagle | @Jonathan - That is a rather powerless God that you portray. God ordains all things, he doesn't leave them to human whimsy. The God you portray in this comment could have his plan fouled by the smallest human error. That's preposterous. | |
| Jan 12, 2012 at 15:16 | comment | added | Jonathan. | ...the other if you decide No. God knows both branches and all the decisions that will need to be made in each branch. That way God can know everything and every outcome and yet we can still have free will. To us the number of "branches" is infinite (if you decide to hold your breath for a fraction of a second that can lead to a whole new branch for every human, so when you have billions and billions of living things as well as the randomness in nature, the number of possible outcomes is indescribable but God knows every single one, and to him it's the equivalent of us being able to count to 5 | |
| Jan 12, 2012 at 15:10 | comment | added | Jonathan. | @waxeagle, imo, If a parent doesn't intend their child to grow and be a doctor they won't lock them away to prevent it. Same thing with God, he would have preferred that they hadn't sinned, but God knows everything, every decision we have to make he knows what will happen in each possible answer. Since the beginning of everything God has known every possible outcome for every possible decision including the decisions that we will never have to make. In Science , there is an idea (I seriously hesitate to theory) that when you make decision "time" splits off, one branch if you decide Yes... | |
| Sep 5, 2011 at 17:47 | history | edited | wax eagle | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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| Sep 5, 2011 at 17:11 | comment | added | RCIX | Well, and this is something I haven't really worked out much beyond an "it doesn't feel right", but what would be the point of not giving us free will? Then we'd be no better than [insert animal here] who loves Him because He's forced them to, and I don't see how that would glorify Him at all. And if you DO give free will to humans, then they must be allowed to A: actually make a choice with that free will (thus the reason to have the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil in the Garden), B; have the consequences of that choice fully carried out. | |
| Sep 5, 2011 at 17:05 | comment | added | wax eagle | @Rcix. If God did not intend for us to sin why didn't he prevent it? Why on earth would an omniscient and omnipotent being allow something he did not intend. From our perspective we have free will, from God's it's a laughable triviality. | |
| Sep 5, 2011 at 16:35 | comment | added | RCIX | I wouldn't say that god "intended" for us to sin; He allowed it because we have free will and that was our choice, but He didn't do anything to help it along... @Jonathan: I can certainly understand having that viewpoint, I was once wondering whether something like that was true myself. This answer I wrote explains why god gave us free will in the first place. | |
| Sep 5, 2011 at 16:23 | comment | added | Caleb | @Jonathan That's a very interesting point to consider, there is certainly more than one religion using the "Christian" moniker. You should keep digging until you get to the bottom of it all :) | |
| Sep 5, 2011 at 15:42 | comment | added | Jonathan. | yes I am aware I vote for a member of parliament and they represent me in parliament. I didnt vote, nor did anyone agree or say ok, etc, to Adam and Eve being our representives. What was Adams right to interfere with Eve's free will? Growing up I was told God loves you for who you are, since joining this site I am starting to wonder if I was brought up s Christian or some other religion that happens to have the same name. | |
| Sep 5, 2011 at 15:39 | comment | added | wax eagle | God cares only for his own glory, he is perfect and thus deserves the glory. Yes he created us for his own pleasure and he works out the world in order that he can glorify himself. @Caleb describes God as a full-on egoist and I'm inclined to agree. | |
| Sep 5, 2011 at 15:35 | comment | added | wax eagle | Jonathan, are you familiar with how representation works in government? Adam and Eve were our representatives. 2nd Adam and Eve both ate the fruit, Adam was right with Eve when she ate it, he know what she was doing. Adam's sin was actually worse because he wasn't directly tempted. Sin existed (Lucifer fell before creation.) but had not entered the world, I believe Lucifer was allowed to act on earth because God allowed him to (the discussion between God and Satan in Job would be and example of how this worked). Thus God allowed (planned for) sin to enter the world. | |
| Sep 5, 2011 at 15:29 | comment | added | Jonathan. | ...temptation to what she did. You make God sound like one of those demonic Gods you see in scifi films which use humans for their own pleasure, etc. (eg Ori in Stargate) | |
| Sep 5, 2011 at 15:28 | comment | added | Jonathan. | So god made every suffer just increase his own glory, aren't we told to exactly not that. You can't say that any human would have done the same thing, unless youre saying that anyone then would be Adam and Eve the people and not themselves as we know today. some people obey the people in authority. Only 1/2 the population at the time chose to eat the apple (first). Maybe the serpent choose eve to persuade because it knew Adam wouldn't or would be less likely to. It also says that that action brought sin into the world, clearly sin already existed in the serpent, and Eve had the sinful... | |
| Sep 5, 2011 at 14:47 | history | answered | wax eagle | CC BY-SA 3.0 |