John 1:14 says the logos became flesh.

This occurred ~ 4BC so we should not say that Jesus was 'in the beginning' at John 1:1 as Jesus was not born yet. There is no mention of Jesus anywhere before his conception except in prophecy and vague reference of the one to come, never by name.

God the Son, as God, so cannot die or be tempted or sin. Jesus could do all of these things, so it seems Jesus is a new person resulting from God's Spirit and Mary.

Where is God the Son while Jesus is on earth? Are they the same person?

We cannot use verses noted below as they are taken out of context to show support for a God the Son.

I and the Father are one John 8:40

Before Abraham was I am John 8:58

Your throne, O God, will last for ever Heb 1:8

  • 3
    Most Christians would say a creed doesn't supersede scripture, and especially not anyone who thinks a particular creed is opposed by scripture! – curiousdannii Apr 23 '20 at 0:58
  • no, clearly, yet the biblical evidence says otherwise. As it has been put, the creeds are 'extra-biblical', therefore are not from God (it could be argued) – user47952 Apr 23 '20 at 1:10
  • 2
    I'd be very surprised if those who accept, for example, the Nicene Creed believe Scripture doesn't support its assertions. (That creed, by the way, doesn't proclaim Jesus' equality with the Father but his being of one substance with the Father.) – Matt Gutting Apr 23 '20 at 1:45
  • 1
    @user48152 Two people have already voted to have this question closed because it does not conform to community guidelines. Specifically, you do not appear to have done any research and have failed to provide any evidence to back up your claims. Please take our tour to help you understand what makes for a good question and what sort of questions are allowed: christianity.stackexchange.com/tour – Lesley Apr 23 '20 at 6:54
  • responding to advice for imminent closure... I asked a straightforward question that expectedly got responses from people following tradition rather than the 'approved text'. As this is not supposed to be a dialogue, it's pointless going forward. So many comments lack credibility as they mis represent the biblical passage being quoted. Which is totally fine, that's what we have all been taught - that doesn't make it right! – user47952 Apr 23 '20 at 9:39

The creeds served various purposes. They corrected various heresies that had arisen at the time. The Nicene Creed was written to confront and expose the Arian heresy. This heresy denied the deity of Jesus Christ. The Jehovah Witnesses are "Arians" who deny the deity of Jesus Christ.

The creeds also serve to identify what essential doctrines are as opposed to peripheral points or issues. One's salvation is not based on when Jesus Christ is returning for His church. One's salvation is based on the fact that Jesus Christ is God, this is an essential truth.

You should also know that the creeds are based on the Bible and of course they do not supercede scripture and they are not scripture. In fact, the Bible itself contains "creeds." The Shema/Deuteronomy 6:4 is an expression of the uniqueness and unity of God.

1 Corinthians 15:3-4 is a creed where the Apostle Paul capsulizes the gospel. So is 1 Timothy 2:5-6. I purposefully did not quote the verses so you could look them up and see for yourself. In short, they are a guide for the church in affirming doctrinal truth, refuting error, and encouraging doctrinal instruction.

Now, regarding what you said about Jesus Christ not being equal to His Father. The Jews accused Jesus Christ of blasphemy for being equal to His Father. Just read John 5:17,18, John 8:57-59, John 10:30 through 37, John 19:7 and the complete trial record at Matthew 26:57-68.

Please take note of John 5:18, "For this cause therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because (or why?) He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, MAKING HIMSELF EQUAL WITH GOD."

Finally, the reason Jesus Christ submitted Himself and was subservient to His Father was because He took the form of a bond-servant/man. This is clearly explained at Philippians 2:5-10. Jesus Christ, who existed as God the Son emptied Himself and took the form of a servant/man. In doing that He laid aside His glory with the Father "BEFORE THE WORLD WAS" (John 17:5) to die for the sins of the world. After His ascension He returned to His original state of glory He already had in the first place.

I want to address John 10:30 where Jesus says literally, I and the Father We are one." According to the context Jesus had just stated that the sheep are equally safe in His hand and in His Father's hand. The power of the Son is equal to that of the Father. It also goes without saying that the Son and the Father are one in purpose.

There is much more at work here because the word "one" (hen) is a neuter number to indicate equality of essence, attributes, design, will and work. Jesus distinguishes the "I" from the "Father" and uses the plural verb "are" denoting "we are." Thus asserts their unity of essence or nature as identical. The Jews knew exactly what Jesus had said and that's why they said at John 10:33, "The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You being a man make yourself out God." If you want I can also address why Jesus Christ brought up Psalm 82:6 from John 10:34-38.

  • thank you for your answer. May I say that, yes the Jews accused Jesus of being equal, they also said, (as you've noted) that he broke the sabbath - Jesus never did either! Are we to make doctrine from wrongful accusations? – user47952 Apr 23 '20 at 1:56
  • My question related to extra- biblical creeds - sry, that could have been clearer – user47952 Apr 23 '20 at 1:57
  • 2
    @user48152 How is it that you can say the Jews made wrongful accusations when you did not even read the verses I posted? Especially the trial record at Matthew 26:57-66. And, if they were wrongful accusations according to you then your the one that has to prove it. It also shows that you already made up your mind and of your position in the first place? What happened to having an open mind and being teachable? Lastly can you give me some examples of which of the creeds oppose the truth? – Mr. Bond Apr 23 '20 at 2:08
  • "the fact that Jesus Christ is God, this is an essential truth". I'd suggest that this is also 'extra-biblical', as Jesus consistently says he has the same God as us and they are also consistently seen as distinct, the mediator between God and man, the man Jesus, and 1 Cor 8:6 etc etc. – user47952 Apr 23 '20 at 2:09
  • 2
    @user48152 This isn't an internet forum for the arguing of points. This is a question and answer site. If you find that this answer is helpful, up vote it. If you don't, then don't. An express purpose of the entire family of SE sites is to not be forums. Please stop treating this site as though it were one. – KorvinStarmast Apr 23 '20 at 20:25

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.