Timeline for Matthew 11:3: Was John the Baptist losing his faith?
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
24 events
| when toggle format | what | by | license | comment | |
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| Sep 4, 2016 at 19:28 | comment | added | user22553 | Let us continue this discussion in chat. | |
| Sep 4, 2016 at 6:01 | comment | added | jaguar | I am a little bit puzzled here. How is KJV rendering heretical? Is it because it states Jesus' being the Son of man as the reason why He was given the authority to execute judgement? | |
| Sep 3, 2016 at 19:17 | comment | added | user22553 | Re John 5:26-28 ... KJV reads "And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man. Marvel not at this ...". Alternate reading is "And Hath given him authority to execute judgment also. That He is the Son of man, marvel not at this ..." | |
| Sep 3, 2016 at 19:14 | comment | added | user22553 | Noted. I edited my sentence. | |
| Sep 3, 2016 at 19:14 | history | edited | user22553 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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| Sep 3, 2016 at 18:57 | comment | added | jaguar | So, what you meant was "missed in the modern translations" instead of "completely missed by modern Bible scholars", right? I, in fact, stumbled upon some works by modern scholars , in which both of these points were mentioned. BTW, what rendering, (precisely, what punctuation exactly) must be then in John 5:26-28 so as not to sound heretical? | |
| Sep 3, 2016 at 18:35 | comment | added | user22553 | Another maybe more interesting one is John 5:26-28. Every single English version except one that I can find has a heretical translation. The words are literally correct, but the punctuation is put in the wrong place. The old manuscripts had no punctuation, but the Fathers knew where the pauses should go. Chyrsostom (then Theophylact) identify the reading that modern translators happen to choose as a heretical reading used by Paul of Samosata to attack the divinity of Christ. | |
| Sep 3, 2016 at 18:31 | comment | added | user22553 | @jaguar - One example is John 3:3. ἄνωθεν can mean either "again" or "from above". When Jesus speaks to Nicodemus he means the first sense (consistent with v.5-6), but Nicodemus understands the second. Chrysostom, then Theophylact, point this out. The dialog between N. and Christ makes much more sense when one is aware of the cause of N.'s confusion, I think. Until recently, almost every version read "again" (ISV and NET now say "from above") ... | |
| Sep 3, 2016 at 18:15 | comment | added | jaguar | "...and often point out subtleties in the Greek text that are completely missed by modern Bible scholars." - Can you provide some examples here? | |
| Aug 31, 2016 at 1:52 | comment | added | user22553 | @jaguar, you're absolutely right. I had to edit another question for that reason. I was confused. +1 for you, -1 for me. Sorry. | |
| Aug 30, 2016 at 23:35 | comment | added | jaguar | "The original question wasn't worded asking for interpretation from all three branches" - I am sorry, but this is not true. | |
| Aug 30, 2016 at 20:30 | history | edited | user22553 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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| Aug 30, 2016 at 20:26 | comment | added | user22553 | @Nathaniel - added some additional info. | |
| Aug 30, 2016 at 20:25 | history | edited | user22553 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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| Aug 30, 2016 at 19:59 | comment | added | user22553 | I'll edit. Just let me fix some tea first. | |
| Aug 30, 2016 at 19:56 | comment | added | user22553 | Well John Chrysostom is also a Doctor of the Roman Catholic Church and John MacArthur called him a "great preacher". Can I check the other two boxes at this point? (The original question wasn't worded asking for interpretation from all three branches) | |
| Aug 30, 2016 at 19:11 | comment | added | Nathaniel is protesting | This is another example of an answer that may be deleted because it doesn't attempt to describe the views of all three groups mentioned in the question. Consider checking how Aquinas and a few Protestant commentaries deal with this verse as well, to confirm if this analysis is indeed shared by all three branches. | |
| Aug 25, 2016 at 17:38 | comment | added | user22553 | Theophylact's sources for Matthew and John was largely the 4th century Homilies of John Chrysostom, who doesn't consider that possibility in his homilies. In keeping with Scripture, John was the greatest of all Prophets (Luke 7:28), so it would never have occurred to them that John's faith in Christ wavered. Because Orthodox faithful would have had the utmost respect for John the Baptist (there are 7 different feast days commemorating him in the Church), Matthew 11:3 seemed paradoxical and needed explanation. | |
| Aug 25, 2016 at 17:14 | comment | added | jaguar | Did Theophylact put forth any reason why it couldn't be a case of John firstly firmly believing that Jesus was the Lamb of God, but later, during the time of his imprisonment, starting to have doubts or some misunderstandings - like in case with Peter (being called "blessed" by the Lord for receiving the revelation from the Father in heaven in Matthew 16:17 and just a few minutes later being called "Satan" by the Lord in Matthew 16:23 for obviously not thinking along the lines of the revelation received)? | |
| Aug 24, 2016 at 14:56 | comment | added | user22553 | @jaguar - I attempted to address your additional questions | |
| Aug 24, 2016 at 14:55 | history | edited | user22553 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
Addressed two questions that arose in a comment
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| Aug 24, 2016 at 14:26 | comment | added | user22553 | @jaguar - these are really interesting questions. I am adding to my original post to answer. | |
| Aug 24, 2016 at 14:00 | comment | added | jaguar | Does he say anything there on why John the Baptist needed to pretend instead of simply telling his disciples, "Go and look at all the miracles He performs"? And also, following the words "Look, then, how Christ answers the question...", does he say anything there on why Jesus asked the disciples to “go back and report to John..." (Matthew 11:4) while He knew that it was all about the John's disciples rather than John himself? | |
| Aug 24, 2016 at 13:35 | history | answered | user22553 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |