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Simple and easy. I am looking for Biblical support (not opinion) for and against the view of predestination. Predestination is the view that all events are willed by God. I'm looking for both sides of the view, not just one side. What Biblical evidence exists for/against predestination?

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many people would view predestination along the lines of: it doesn't matter what you do, God has already decided where you will end up. I view that all events are willed by God would be more along the lines of the deterministic universe described in philosophy. –  ryan May 3 '12 at 19:28

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up vote 6 down vote accepted

In Support

Proverbs 16:33 The lot is cast into the lap, but its every decision is from the LORD.

Even the dice fall according to God's plan.

Ephesians 1:11 In [Christ] we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will

God works everything according to his will.

Psalm 139:16 Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there were none of them.

God has written down (in other words, planned to the letter!) every day of our life before they even come to pass.

Matthew 10:30-31a But even the hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not; therefore

God knows how many hairs you have. He's counted them.

And now allow me to quote at length Louis Berkof, Systematic Theology, pg. 168, quoted in the Reformation Study Bible

The Bible clearly teaches God's providential control

  1. over the universe at large, Ps. 103:19; Dan. 4:35; Eph. 1:11;
  2. over the physical world, Job 37; Ps. 104:14; 135:6; Matt. 5:45;
  3. over the brute creation, Ps. 104:21, 28; Mt. 6:26; 10:29;
  4. over the affairs of nations, Job 12:23; Ps. 22:28; 66:7; Acts 17:26
  5. over man's birth and lot in life, 1 Sam. 16:1; Ps. 139:16; Isa. 45:5; Gal. 1:15-16
  6. over the outward successes and failures of men's lives, Ps. 75:6-7, Lk. 1:52
  7. over things seemingly accidental or insignificant, Prov. 16:33; Matt. 10:30
  8. in protection of the righteous, Ps. 4:8; 5:12; 63:8; 121:3; Rom. 8:28
  9. in supplying the wants of God's people, Gn. 22:8, 14; Deut. 8:3; Phil. 4:19
  10. in giving answers to prayer, 1 Sam. 1:19; Isa. 20:5-6; 2 Chron. 33:13; Ps. 65:2 Mt. 7:7; Lk. 18:7-8
  11. in the exposure and punishment of the wicket, Ps. 7:12-13; 11:6

Against

I'm not very familiar with verses against Predestination, but as I understand it, a lot of the argument against it is an interpretive argument; and those who are opposed to the doctrine would say the verses above are more general in nature and are simply talking about his omnipotence, not his nitty-gritty control over the details. I'll leave it to someone more versed in this position to answer for the against side.

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"Predestination is the view that all events are willed by God." Sorry, but biblical opposition to this definition is found in the very use of the word.

Romans 8:29

For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

The context is that God has predestined, or predetermined, that all who walk in faith in Jesus will be conformed to His Son; they will undergo the process of conformity to His Son. God has predestined a process, not individuals.

Unfortunately, people isolate the verse and don’t read it according to the context in Romans. Throughout Romans we find that we have choices and they can alter our destiny so that we undego this process or not. What started us on this process? God choosing us beforehand? No, through our faith in Jesus upon hearing the gospel:

Rom. 3:26

To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

We have daily choices to live holy or not, to live for God or the flesh, and those choices will determine our future:

Rom. 6:16

Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

If we live according to the flesh, then we will die, but if we surrender to the Spirit to die to the flesh, we shall live:

Rom. 8:13

For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

Which direction leads us to conformity to Christ? Which goes against it?

In none of these chapters in Romans 1-8 do we find Paul telling us that God chose us before we were born or that our destiny is preordained because He chose us. That thought is entirely absent from Romans 1-8. Romans 1-8 sets the foundation for understanding the word predestinated in Romans 8. Everything we need to learn about predestination has already been written in Romans 1-8. That’s right: we don’t need Calvin or Arminius :) .

What about Romans 8:28?

Romans 8:28

And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

That is the sense the believer receives who has surrendered all to God out of love, and has allowed Him to work in his life. He is not trusting in his flesh, and found that God is working out His will in all the events of his life. God can freely move in that life in all things because the believer has surrendered to God that way, giving Him full permission to move as He wishes. The verse does not mean that God moves against our wills. Read Romans 1-8 to see this in context. This is the person who has undergone the predestined process of conformity to Christ and is enjoying its fruits.

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If we choose to live after the flesh, then we are predestined to NOT be conformed to the image of Christ! Those who meet the qualifications of faith ARE predestined to do so, simply because that's the way we stay in the process ("Abide in Me"). God saw in His foreknowledge that people will respond to Christ's death, burial and resurrection by a faith that works in love, and has predestined that process to fulfill all His purposes. –  Steve Mar 20 at 13:02

The Against, Apologeticism Against Predestination

In one response Ephesians 3:7-18 I became a servant of this gospel by the gift of God’s grace given me through the working of his power. 8 Although I am less than the least of all the Lord’s people, this grace was given me: to preach to the Gentiles the boundless riches of Christ, 9 and to make plain to everyone the administration of this mystery, which for ages past was kept hidden in God, who created all things. 10 His intent was that now, through the church, the manifold wisdom of God should be made known to the rulers and authorities in the heavenly realms, 11 according to his eternal purpose that he accomplished in Christ Jesus our Lord. 12 In him and through faith in him we may approach God with freedom and confidence.

AND

2 Peter 3:9

9 The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.

I encourage everyone to keep reading but if not, that should suffice to say, God gives all man free will, without reproach, so that we in turn may love him dearly. If you continue to read, grab your Bibles, or look up every verse, for the words of man is but a glimmer and whisper in the voice of the God that spoke the creation of the Universe and all things righteous. And predestination can rebuked by one question of wisdom, “How are you supposed to submit to his will and love him, if he divinely controls everything? How can you obey someone if you cannot disobey? This violates every book of the Bible, and the faith and doctrine, and salvation of Christ Jesus. In Genesis Eve took from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, then would that not make God the creator of disobedience of his will and law? So too if God predestined everything, then too all choice, salvation, sin, everything, he created, and if so, then you cannot love him, nor believe in him, only obey him, simple as that, and therefore nothing is good, nothing is righteous, and there is no salvation, and Christ Jesus died for no reason. This is rebuked with 1 Corinthians 13.

At this point without absolute free choice, then faith is pointless, and so is the law of God, for if God exists and reveals himself only to those predetermined, than he does not reveal to all. This is rebuked by Romans 4.

If the idea that predestination exists and is true, then it too must also completely take God of the throne of righteousness, and would be full of sin because he created and permits sin. This is rebuked by Galatians 2:17-21 But if, in our endeavor to be justified in Christ, we too were found to be sinners, is Christ then a servant of sin? Certainly not! 18For if I rebuild what I tore down, I prove myself to be a transgressor. 19For through the law I died to the law, so that I might live to God. 20I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness were through the law, then Christ died for no purpose.

How can does predetermination mean God is in fact Satan? Because that means all sin was created by God, and all men that practice sin, is through God's will, that God created Satan, and Satan is on the same level of righteousness, because Satan did not reject God's authority, but rather submits to it, I hate even having to write those words in the same sentence. Predestination completely changes the fundamental relationship with God, his plan, his purpose, our purpose, everything, and promotes God to the same level as us, and Satan. Its clear this is a truly, deeply, corrosive, corrupt, way false doctrine, extremely blasphemous, and downright ludicrous. Jesus cannot fulfill the law if he created sin, and Jesus is God. So to if the Holy Spirit dwells within Christians then so to must the Spirit of God be full of sin, if God is not separate from us. Literally no matter what way you think about it, its fallacy, blasphemy, and heresy.

In leaving I must say this of myself, I love God with all my heart, my mind, my body, and my soul, and I seek to do nothing that does not glorify him, but more importantly, I love him so much, I would do anything he asks of me, and if my faith became nothing but a plan, and obedience, with no reason to love, nor desire to be righteous and blemish free before him, my spirit would ache and yearn for something more, and therefore the spot that God is supposed to fill, its now empty. Please read all the renaming verses and I promise you'll know the truth to be revealed to you, God wants everyone to come to him, everyone, not just some favorites.

2 Timothy 3:16-17
16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

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A little excessive on the formatting, but a decent answer. Welcome to the site. –  fredsbend Oct 12 at 3:35

If your definition of predestination is - "Predestination is the view that all events are willed by God", then I would say that the Bible doesn't support this at all.

If all events were willed by God, it would be absolutely redundant for Jesus to ask us to pray this way -

Our Father, who art in heaven.... Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done... (Matthew 6:10)

If God's will is always done, we don't need to pray that his will be done. God's will is always done in only one sense - God's will is that man have free will and choose God or reject God.

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Theologians often make a distinction between God's prescriptive will (what he commands) and his decretive will (what he directs to actually happen). We'd say that "will" in Matt. 6:10 is prescriptive will, which goes along with "thy kingdom come". –  Thomas Shields May 7 '12 at 2:25

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